Let's Play 'What If?'

[gordphish]

Here is a hypothetical worth considering.

By noon eastern on Tuesday, Sundin is in Detroit, Hossa is in Dallas, Jokinen is a Flame (finally) and the Sharks have added Richards and/or Boyle.

All of a sudden, Brian Burke's name pops up on Dave Nonis' call display. Desperate to add a top 6 scorer, Burke offers Nonis Bobby Ryan, the lottery pick in the 08 draft and a second round pick in 09 for Naslund.

We've heard Nonis say time and again that he'd trade anyone if it improved the hockey club. Could he afford to pass on a deal like that, even if it meant putting a playoff spot this season in jeapordy?

It might be a very important question for Nonis by Tuesday, and one that could define the shape of this club's future for the next decade.

So, what does he do?

[KB in Kelowna]

As much as I like Markus, I make the deal. The team could still stay in playoff contention, but they don't match the depth of Anaheim, Detroit, Dallas, San Jose and the Flames (uggh). With a lottery pick alot of names then pop up on Dave Nonis' call display before the draft.

[gordphish]

Here's another hypothetical for you...

To Tampa - K. Bieksa, B. Morrison, C. Schneider
To Vancouver - B. Richards

If that were the deal, would you be happy with it?

[Nelson19777]

I take both of those deals. But the Naslund one is a dream. We'd like it to be true, but his value isn't that high.

[AtLossForWords]

I look at this two fold.

If I see that Sundin is in Detroit, and more so that Jokinen is a Flame I have to make one of the two deals.

If this team has an offer for Naslund you have to consider it. Those moves would make your greatest competition in the Western Conference much better than they were. Jokinen would give the Flames a very big goal scoring top six, and Sundin would only add a number one center to a team that has a solid top line. You'd have to believe that Detroit could ice two first lines a game when healthy.

Even with Luongo on your side, that is an awful lot for an under talented roster to overcome. If you can't beat that, you can't win a Cup.

If I make the Anaheim deal I'm pleased with Bobby Ryan and the lottery pick that could land me Stephen Stamkos, but since Burke is desparate I try to rip him off and ask for Ryan Carter as well.

Naslund would surely waive his no-trade-clause to play for his old GM and old buddy Todd Bertuzzi.

However if I don't want to give up, I make the Richards deal. That's the only way to put my team back into contention, to add a Conn Smythe winner to my team.

Would Richards be the center for Naslund, I'm not sure. He's not big, he's not going to create space, but he's going to get him the puck when he needs it. However Richards might be a perfect fit for Pyatt and Raymond.

Make

Pyatt Richards Raymond

your first line and

Sedin Sedin Naslund

your second line, and just like Detroit you have two lines that can produce like first lines when called up, but instead of having Swedes that may underperform in the playoffs, you can call upon a Conn Smythe winner to lead your team offensively.

There's speculation that Feaster has been asked by ownership to get what he can for Richards, and the Canucks could offer the best package assuming Sundin, Hossa, and Jokinen have all found suitors.

[TimmyTabasco]

As mentioned in the other threads, Richards has too high a price tag. The Canucks can't afford to put 14 million into two players

Richards would help the team, but makes too much money

Bobby Ryan would be interesting, especially if Naslund resigned with the Canucks. Lets not forget, Burke isn't stupid

[gordphish]

As mentioned in the other threads, Richards has too high a price tag. The Canucks can't afford to put 14 million into two players

Richards would help the team, but makes too much money

Bobby Ryan would be interesting, especially if Naslund resigned with the Canucks. Lets not forget, Burke isn't stupid

First off, Richards is not too expensive for the Canucks. Yes, when you take on a salary like that you have to do your due diligence first. But they won't be able to keep paying guys like Pyatt, Raymond and Kesler what they are making now forever. Now is when you add a player like Richards to get the most out those players when you have them on the cheap.

Think back to when Scott Neidermayer was UFA. There were four teams in the running for his services; New Jersey, Anaheim, Calgary and Vancouver. Anaheim was the only team willing to buck up and pay him 8 million per, and guess what? The Ducks went to the conference final in the first year of his contract and won the Stanley Cup in the second.

It's not like the Canucks would be the only team with two players making over 6 million on their roster. It might make it challenging to resign Naslund, but I doubt it. What do you think Naslund is going to do? Take 4 million to stay on a team that has just added another elite player, where he'll be able to play with the Sedins all year and have the personal pressure to produce reduced, or take 5 million to pack his family up and move them away from the place they've called home for the last dozen years?

Take a look at this lineup:

Daniel / Henrik / Naslund
Pyatt / Richards / Raymond
Burrows / Kesler / ???
Brown / Ritchie / Cowan

Edler / Ohlund
Bourdon / Mitchell
Salo / Krajicek
???

Luongo
Sanford

With Naslund signed at 4 mil and Brown, Ritchie and Sanford brought back at the same money, that roster would cost them 46.691 million (with the 300 grand for the Chouinard buyout factored in). If the cap is 53 million next year and they top out at 51 million, that gives them just under 5 million to sign a third line forward and fill out the spares. It also leaves them in the position to leave 5 million free to put towards the Sedin and Ohlund extensions next summer.

They could resign Miller for the same money, bring Shannon, Grabner, Jaffrey or Hansen up to play on the third line and still be in pretty good shape.

Richards is EXACTLY what this team is missing.

His contract is NOT too expensive for them. I don't usually put a lot of stock into Eklund's rumours, but this time I believe him when he says he's hearing that Vancouver is the leading team in terms of interest for Richards. The Canucks have the need, the assets and the coming cap room to make this deal. All it takes now is the will.

Now for the Naslund deal.

It is precisely the fact that Burke is not stupid that he would make that deal. His job in Anaheim is not to build for the future. It is to win NOW. He has Perry to resign this summer, and Neidermayer, Schneider and Beauchemin all enter into the final years of their deals next year. Burke needs another scorer, and in Naslund he'd get a player to play with Bertuzzi that would up the production in BOTH players. Burke knows he's going to move that lottery pick to get one of the impact scorers available anyways, and deleting a player of value off his roster to get that scorer isn't going to help make his team better. Enter Ryan. And because Burke has Bertuzzi for next year as well, there would be a good chance he'd be able to resign Naslund, probably a better chance that resigning Hossa or Sundin. And if he can get Naslund inked next year, it increases his chances at attracting Forsberg for next year.

Maybe you make the second round pick conditional or whether or not Naslund stays in Anaheim. But Burke knows that that is a fair deal, and if all other options are off the table, I think he'd make it in a heartbeat.

[AtLossForWords]

After this last winning streak, I believe Nonis looks at his team as a committed buyer. After beating Detroit, he's seen what's it's like when another team loses four top defensemen, and our small slide has looked like tripping over a loose shoelace compared to Detroit's last eleven games.

I actually think our team is a lot like Detroit in certain respects.

The game starts in net, both of these teams depend on the guy between the pipes getting it done, and more often than not they do.

Both teams are really dependant upon their top line to provide their scoring with not much coming up behind it in the way of forwards. The plus side is that they can rely on anyone they need to check the opposition when holding a lead or playing to a tie.

Both teams depend on their blueliners for secondary scoring, when they don't pinch the zone and join in on the rush, the forwards are easily shut down. Detroit was 1/7 on the PP in Vancouver with no Lidstrom or Rafalski.

Now as far as Richards is concerned, I think Gordo makes very good points. He is what we need, but he comes at a cost. I don't care that he is a -25 and is on pace for his lowest point total in like three years. He's playing with 4th liners on a club with no defense.

The Canucks can afford him, especially if the salary of Bieksa or Salo is moving the other way. If you can throw Cooke into this deal, you have a lot of flexibility as far as the cap limit is concerned.

Sure there are players who are going to be due for raises, but what team's roster is ever going to look the same one year to the next anymore? Guys like Pyatts, Millers, and Cookes will come around. The Canucks have good prospects who can play solid NHL minutes to fill the bottom six.

Hansen can fill a bottom six role. Jaffray can work as a fourth line center, he's not tough, but he's a solid spot on the roster. Grabner may be ready for some NHL minutes. Mike Brown is pretty much Matt Cooke, but I think he has a college degree in something.

Naslund is a Canuck, I don't think he's going anywhere at this age. If this was the lockout year, if you don't pay Naslund he goes to the open market, however it's clear to many teams he is on the decline in production. Only to push even harder that he's a Canuck for life, he'll almost quote Mats Sundin about how he doesn't want to play anywhere else, and it's most likely his team or none at all. Naslund has been paid for what he has contributed to this team, and I don't think he's going to sacrifice his comfort level in Vancouver for an extra million on a dark horse in a city with shitty weather.

I say if you're not giving a ridiculous amount of players away, go for Brad Richards and get a piece that you really need to complete this team.

I don't think there is as much market for Richards, and that will drive the asking price down. The GM that gets Richards is going to be the winner, because instead of falling victim to Waddel for Hossa, Fletcher for Sundin, or Martin for Jokinen. The GM that gets Richards is going to prove how a -25 player on pace for his lowest point total in years does not have the value of a supposed franchise winger like Hossa, a warhorse captain who has gotten the job done year after year, or a big center who scores goals while playing a physical game to lead his team.

I hear the two teams with the most interest in Richards are the Jackets and the Canucks. I don't see why a player with a NTC won't try to choose his destination, and I don't think for Brad Richards that there is much of a doubt of who he would rather play for when asked. If Richards is going to be dealt, if he controls his fate enough only to go where he wants Vancouver might not have to pay as much to get what they need out of this deadline.

[TimmyTabasco]

How many threads are we discussing Brad Richards?

Anyway..I had a change of mind last night..

This acquisition would make the team a totally different team

-Luongo
-Richards
-Twins

Thats another level altogether. Add a solid supporting cast, solid defense, and you have a contender

So..lets say Nonis pulls off a deal for Richards..somehow..

I really think it would be wise to make a secondary move for Modin(or to a lesser degree, Fedotenko). He has played with Richards, and had a lot of success. Plus, he could also play with the twins

Sed-Sed-Modin
Naslund-Richards-Raymond
Pyatt-Kesler-Burrows

Thats a decent lineup. Ofcourse you could tinker, and change around the lines

[Vanfan]

Richards is a salary dump by TB.
Perhaps Bourdon,Schneider and a pick but you don't give up Bieska, Morrison and Schneider.The reason you go after Richards is to make a serious run at the cup for now and next year. Getting rid of Bieska and Morrison doesn't help.

[Vanfan]

Here is a hypothetical worth considering.

By noon eastern on Tuesday, Sundin is in Detroit, Hossa is in Dallas, Jokinen is a Flame (finally) and the Sharks have added Richards and/or Boyle.

All of a sudden, Brian Burke's name pops up on Dave Nonis' call display. Desperate to add a top 6 scorer, Burke offers Nonis Bobby Ryan, the lottery pick in the 08 draft and a second round pick in 09 for Naslund.

We've heard Nonis say time and again that he'd trade anyone if it improved the hockey club. Could he afford to pass on a deal like that, even if it meant putting a playoff spot this season in jeapordy?

It might be a very important question for Nonis by Tuesday, and one that could define the shape of this club's future for the next decade.

So, what does he do?

No Deal!!
The Canucks are a goal scorer or two away from being a serious contender.With arguably the best goaltender in the league hitting his prime the time is now to go for the cup(by now I mean 08,09 and 10 )Draft picks will be of help down the road but after 37 years and lots of high draft picks but no cup I'm not willing to watch the team start selling its top players for draft picks.

[grim]

As much as I like Markus, I make the deal. The team could still stay in playoff contention, but they don't match the depth of Anaheim, Detroit, Dallas, San Jose and the Flames (uggh). With a lottery pick alot of names then pop up on Dave Nonis' call display before the draft.

I say Sundin ends up signed & dressed in an Ottawa jersey by Monday gametime. He scores the winner against his former hated Finnish teammate Toastala. High fives. Markus Naslund is impressed and he demands to be traded here too. Arrives here Tuesday morning. Forsberg decides his ankle is okay, and his wealthy family has enough Crocs money already and signs here 2:55 Tuesday, for free. Ottawa throws up the Ikea flags everywhere and renames St Jean Baptiste day... Roxette day... a federal government statuatory holiday for Federal Quebec workers. Alfie and new Swedish linemates move in together in a Kanata townhouse. Naslund regains former talent thanks to the "change of scenery". Flatter here. Just like Sveeden. Scandanavian death metal takes its rightful place in the Corel Centre game day rotation. Cup is won. Everyone is happy. You're the best swedish player! No... you are.

http://blogs.tampabay.com/breakingnews/images/2007/11/14/tb_ikea450a.jpg

[gordphish]

Richards is a salary dump by TB.
Perhaps Bourdon,Schneider and a pick but you don't give up Bieska, Morrison and Schneider.The reason you go after Richards is to make a serious run at the cup for now and next year. Getting rid of Bieska and Morrison doesn't help.

And like I said on another site, do you expect to get Richards for Ritchie, Grabner and a Robert Nordmark jersey?

You can't just give the Lightning Bourdon or Edler, Schneider and a first pick because it doesn't free up the cap room to keep this team largly intact beyond this season.

They don't need Morrison because they are upgrading his postition with Richards. Bieksa is the main player in the deal from Tampa's POV, and with the depth on defense the Canucks have, they can trade him and still compete. If you don't like giving up a blueliner, then turn around and deal Cooke for a defenseman.

This deal isn't about getting a rental to take a run at it this year, which is still a longshot for them no matter how you slice it. It's about a hockey deal that adds that missing piece that will make them a legit contender for the next decade.

[Vanfan]

Brad Richards at 7.8 mil is only worth it if you don't have to give away a top blueliner or top 6 forward. Sure you're not going to get him for nothing but you don't give same for same as far as talent goes because of his contract.

[gordphish]

Brad Richards at 7.8 mil is only worth it if you don't have to give away a top blueliner or top 6 forward. Sure you're not going to get him for nothing but you don't give same for same as far as talent goes because of his contract.

First off , how is Morrison and Bieksa same for same for Richards? That's just the blue and green kool-aid talking.

Second of all, you can't expect Nonis to fleece people every time out the way he fleeced Keenan in the Luongo deal. It's unrealistic and, quite frankly, bad for business.

Like it or not, if Richards and Feaster accept the Vancouver offer tomorrow, Bieksa or Edler are a part of that deal.

http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/news_story/?ID=230469&hubname=

[Vanfan]

Bieska , a prospect and a pick for Richards, I'd do that deal in a heartbeat,but Not Morrison and Bieska due to the 7.8 mil.
Richards is not putting up the numbers this year and while there may be many reasons why, it is foolish to think he will magically play like the Conn smythe Richards once he puts on the bleu and green.
At 7.8 giving up atop forward and defenseman is too big a gamble.

[AtLossForWords]

Bieska , a prospect and a pick for Richards, I'd do that deal in a heartbeat,but Not Morrison and Bieska due to the 7.8 mil.
Richards is not putting up the numbers this year and while there may be many reasons why, it is foolish to think he will magically play like the Conn smythe Richards once he puts on the bleu and green.
At 7.8 giving up atop forward and defenseman is too big a gamble.

Bieksa and Morrison would be the best deal for this team, and Tampa Bay would be stupid to take that one. The only way that is considered an even deal is if your iris shows the colors of black, yellow, and red. :laughing:

Bieksa, Schnieder, and Cooke would be a very good deal for this team.

Kesler, Edler, and a first round pick would be the very worst.

I really think this deal is going to be Bieksa, Bourdon, Schieder, and a 1st round pick for Brad Richards. Supposedly Vancouver and Dallas have made their offers and Tampa is waiting to see where Richards wants to go. I only hope he gets an evening phone call from Roberto Luongo to help him understand what it is like to go from Florida to a hockey mad climate.

[Vanfan]

Bieksa and Morrison would be the best deal for this team, and Tampa Bay would be stupid to take that one. The only way that is considered an even deal is if your iris shows the colors of black, yellow, and red. :laughing:

Bieksa, Schnieder, and Cooke would be a very good deal for this team.

Kesler, Edler, and a first round pick would be the very worst.

I really think this deal is going to be Bieksa, Bourdon, Schieder, and a 1st round pick for Brad Richards. Supposedly Vancouver and Dallas have made their offers and Tampa is waiting to see where Richards wants to go. I only hope he gets an evening phone call from Roberto Luongo to help him understand what it is like to go from Florida to a hockey mad climate.

I'm not completely sold on Richards at 7.8mil.
IMO he's overpaid for a guy who's scored 16 goals this year.
That is why Tampa is getting rid of him and that is why whoever gets him will underpay.

When it comes to evaluating talent on other teams it's often a case of "the grass is always greener..."
Why? Probably because we don't suffer through these players goal scoring droughts and on ice gaffs. All we see are their highlight reel plays and think Wow this guy is great!
Sometimes being a fan is like a marriage: after 5 years you see all the flaws and warts. I believe this is why so many fans want to virtually give away Naslund and Morrison.

[AtLossForWords]

I'm not completely sold on Richards at 7.8mil.
IMO he's overpaid for a guy who's scored 16 goals this year.
That is why Tampa is getting rid of him and that is why whoever gets him will underpay.

When it comes to evaluating talent on other teams it's often a case of "the grass is always greener..."
Why? Probably because we don't suffer through these players goal scoring droughts and on ice gaffs. All we see are their highlight reel plays and think Wow this guy is great!
Sometimes being a fan is like a marriage: after 5 years you see all the flaws and warts. I believe this is why so many fans want to virtually give away Naslund and Morrison.

Richards may be on pace for the lowest point total in three years, but his play in Tampa dictated that should be the value of his contract on the open market. After just winning a Conn Smythe and scoring over 90 points at the close of the dead puck era if he hit the open market I bet you he'd be getting 8 million from a team inside of New York or Ontario.

You have to overpay at any deadline deal. You can only hose a team in the summer. The asking price goes up because more bidders are willing to pay the price. I guarantee you in the summer Peter Forsberg isn't dealt for two quality roster players, a top defensive prospect, and a pick. He goes for a roster player and a top defensive prospect or a pick.

Same case for Tkachuk, St. Louis doesn't get a roster player and three picks in the Summer.

If you're going to deal at the deadline you have to overpay.

I think when you evaluate a talent on another team you have to look at what kind of team/line he plays on and his base stats. Playing alongside Martin St. Louis like he did so much of in '04 or with the slew of other quality forwards Tampa had back then, he's a ninety point scorer. Now he's play with who Jan Hlavac and Michell Oullet or Ryan Craig? That's worse than setting Naslund aside Morrison and Cooke or Smolinksi and Bulis.

Scouts for trades watch a lot more than the highlights a guy makes. They watch his giveaways, skating posture, disposition, and playmaking abilities like a good piece of porn. If Vancouver thought they were getting Brendan Morrison and not a Conn Smythe candidate or franchise center, there wouldn't even be a rumor titled "Richards to Vancouver".

I don't see why fans want to complain about Richards coming here for the reasonable returns we've been discussing. If we could get LeCavalier at the same price, we'd be happier, but he's not available.

Get Brad Richards and hopefully you can trade only Bieksa, Schnieder, and a pick to do it. When he's got his name stiched on to the back of a blue and green RBK sweater with a bleached or blue whale on it stick him with either Naslund and Raymond or Pyatt and Raymond and watch him rack up the same point totals as the Sedin twins if not more.

Brad Richards is exactly what all of us Canuck fans (at least Gordphish and I along with a few others for years). A guy who is capable of center a first line with good playmaking ability who knows how to get it done in the playoffs.

Are you going to want to rely on Linden, Morrison, and Cooke to get your secondary scoring in the playoffs when the Sedins and Naslund dry up after playing against Niedermayer, Pronger, or Lidstrom all night, or would you rather turn to a line with a former Conn Smythe winnner who doesn't have a Stanley Cup ring by accident?

[Vanfan]

"Get Brad Richards and hopefully you can trade only Bieksa, Schnieder, and a pick to do it. "Like Ive said this deal makes sense!
The original deal stated was Bieska ,Morrison and Schneider and that is too much of a gamble for such a big hit to the cap.
You may be right about Richards stats being low because of his linemates but what about Morrisons linemates since Bert left?
A 7.8 mil player MUST put up at least decent numbers no matter who he's playing with.Put a healthy Morrison with St.Louis and another good winger and see if his "game" doesn't magically improve.

Like I have said I would love to give Richards a shot here and hope we get him but not at the expense of what little scoring we already have. Bieksa, prospects and picks are OK with me.

If you're going to deal at the deadline you have to overpay.

The Richards case is unique in that the only reason he is on the market is because he makes 7.8 mil so in effect you are already overpaying for him just by making the deal. What makes it attractive is that you `don`t` have to sell the farm to aquire him.

[AtLossForWords]

"Get Brad Richards and hopefully you can trade only Bieksa, Schnieder, and a pick to do it. "

Like Ive said this deal makes sense!
The original deal stated was Bieska ,Morrison and Schneider and that is too much of a gamble for such a big hit to the cap.
You may be right about Richards stats being low because of his linemates but what about Morrisons linemates since Bert left?

What the big deal about giving up Brendan Morrison, I'd rather give up Brendan Morrison than the first round pick? Like I said early Bieksa, Morrison, and Schnieder would be the best case scenario, because the Canucks are giving up more of what they have plenty of goaltending, defense, and average offensive play.

Morrison has played with a revolving door of Naslund, Pyatt, Raymond, Linden, and Cooke. To add to that he's been on the first powerplay unit on the point when he is healthy which is where he gets most of his points.

Are you seriously trying to tell me that Naslun, Pyatt, or Raymond are only as good of point producers as Hlvac and Ouellet. One guy who couldn't get a contract till training camp and abother guy who couldn't produce points playing with Crosby and Malkin?

[charlio lemieux]

Here is a hypothetical worth considering.

By noon eastern on Tuesday, Sundin is in Detroit, Hossa is in Dallas, Jokinen is a Flame (finally) and the Sharks have added Richards and/or Boyle.

All of a sudden, Brian Burke's name pops up on Dave Nonis' call display. Desperate to add a top 6 scorer, Burke offers Nonis Bobby Ryan, the lottery pick in the 08 draft and a second round pick in 09 for Naslund.

We've heard Nonis say time and again that he'd trade anyone if it improved the hockey club. Could he afford to pass on a deal like that, even if it meant putting a playoff spot this season in jeapordy?

It might be a very important question for Nonis by Tuesday, and one that could define the shape of this club's future for the next decade.

So, what does he do?
Sundin isn't going anywhere.
Brian Burke would give his next 3 years pay if he could stand up at the draft with Kevin Lowe's pick and take Steve Stamkos with the 1st overall selection. That pick is going nowhere. Revenge is a dish best served cold and this one has been cooling since early July 2007.
I would think Bobby Ryan and the Ducks own 1st are up for grabs if the deal is right. By that I mean Jokinen who is still under contract after this year.

Maybe chasing Richards and dangling goalie prospect Schneider with some of you defensive depth is the best answer. A few picks would have to go to TB to get anything done I am sure, but Richards would give the Nucks a good 2nd line with Naslund.

[Vanfan]

I am not and never have stated that I think Morrison is as good as Richards. But Morrison does not make 7.8 mil a year. Morrison is decent (not great)value for the cap hit and we will need all the scoring we can get.You are the one who keeps pointing this out.
I haven`t`seen enough of Richards to know why he is struggling but a 7.8 mil player should put up points even if hes playing with a guy like Dave semenko;)
My point is lets keep them both and for ONCE have a little depth at center.

Its been 37 years, for Gawd sakes get rid of every pick ànd prospect we have while Luongo is here.(within reason:D )

[rustybadcock]

If this trade goes down it will include Luc Bourdon, Schneider our next highest pick and perhaps someone like Ellington. Feaster has already made it clear he wants young D men for Richards and Bourdon means more to him then anyone else on our roster.

Removing Morrison and Bieksa takes two pieces from the puzzle while only adding one in Richards. If young players is what Feaster wants I don't see Morrison being all that attractive anyway. And as I said elsewhere; this teams D was taxed to the max while guys like Bieksa healed. Now that he's back we sure look like a much improved group. Subtracting Bieksa is insane and seriously hampers this team on the back end. It makes no sense to the immediate future of this club. In losing Bourdon, there is time to recover from his loss. Whereas, Bieksa was a low pick who turned into a top tier guy. Like Edler, their diamonds in the rough. You don't look a gift horse....Besides, I don't think the Canucks committed to Kevin last year like they did just to move him this year, no matter what deal presents itself. I'd be very surprised to see him a part of anything in the next 40 hours.

Its going to be a youth movement in South Florida and we should have everything Feaster wants and needs. He wants to move Richards to clear salary in order to bring in a goaltender. He's as much as said so. Bringing in salary like Morrison and Bieksa goes against this plan. The next big contract in Tbay will likely be Boyle and if that doesn't rap up in the next day I'd expect he might be out too. I can see him landing in Detroit but that's another story.

Regardless, I've been dropping Richards name for some time now...I'd like nothing more than to see this guy come aboard. The biggest problem I see with his play of late is shear unhappiness. I mean honestly, Tortarella's a complete phuckwit, can you imagine having to deal with his manic fool? good lord :rolleyes:

Richards has 18 goals 33 assists and is a -25. For the record.

RB

[gordphish]

Bieska , a prospect and a pick for Richards, I'd do that deal in a heartbeat,but Not Morrison and Bieska due to the 7.8 mil.
Richards is not putting up the numbers this year and while there may be many reasons why, it is foolish to think he will magically play like the Conn smythe Richards once he puts on the bleu and green.
At 7.8 giving up atop forward and defenseman is too big a gamble.

OMG...

The guy had 90 points last season, and was top 10 in scoring this year until he came down with mono.

Richards is being traded because ownership has stepped in and told Feaster that a) they would rather keep Boyle (which makes sense because the Lightning don't have much else of note on the blueline), and b) they want to lock up Lecavalier long term. It has nothing to do with Richards' production, or lack there of this season.

In the end, it might come down to giving up that first round pick instead of Morrison because that pick is worth more. And if they do get Richards, Morrison isn't a Canuck next season anyways.

[Nelson19777]

Anybody think TB might want Sandford in this deal? He might be a likely candidate to be one of the throw in roster players.

[TimmyTabasco]

Well, if you acquire Richards..you have to play him with talented wingers. You can't play him with the twins..

So, do you play him with Naslund, and Raymond?

He hasn't played with very good players in TB(Ouellet and Hlavac mostly), and his game has suffered

On the other hand, Jokinen has played well without very good players. So, either one would be a decent pickup..IMO

P.S. Why would they want Sanford? They already have two backups

[gordphish]

Well, if you acquire Richards..you have to play him with talented wingers. You can't play him with the twins..

So, do you play him with Naslund, and Raymond?

He hasn't played with very good players in TB(Ouellet and Hlavac mostly), and his game has suffered

On the other hand, Jokinen has played well without very good players. So, either one would be a decent pickup..IMO

P.S. Why would they want Sanford? They already have two backups

I play Richards with Raymond and Pyatt and play Naslund with the twins.

If it's Jokinen vs Richards, then my response is 'pedigree'.

A Cup ring, Conn Smythe and Memorial Cup MVP vs a player that is about to be traded from his third team because of his attitude.

I just can't see Nonis going for Jokinen. They want players with character here, and Jokinen doesn't fit the bill.

[Vanfan]

OMG...

The guy had 90 points last season, and was top 10 in scoring this year until he came down with mono.

Richards is being traded because ownership has stepped in and told Feaster that a) they would rather keep Boyle (which makes sense because the Lightning don't have much else of note on the blueline), and b) they want to lock up Lecavalier long term. It has nothing to do with Richards' production, or lack there of this season.

In the end, it might come down to giving up that first round pick instead of Morrison because that pick is worth more. And if they do get Richards, Morrison isn't a Canuck next season anyways.


Richards has Mono??
My son had it for a year and a half. You want to go into the playoffs with a guy with mono instead of Morrison? The first round pick will be worth more in three or four years and if you want to build for the future then I agree with you.
Heres another deal I might go with ; Richards for Morrison and Schneider.
The cap is a very important consideration and 7.8 is a huge hit.

We could probably debate this forever but I'm really looking forward to seeing what happens! If we do get Richards I hope you're right and Richards delivers the impact you expect from a 7.8 million dollar player.

Here is an interview with Nonis today :

http://www.nhl.tv/team/console?type=fvod&id=13160&catid=201

[Vanfan]

Are you seriously trying to tell me that Naslun, Pyatt, or Raymond are only as good of point producers as Hlvac and Ouellet. One guy who couldn't get a contract till training camp and abother guy who couldn't produce points playing with Crosby and Malkin?

You made my point.
I will bet that both Malkin and Crosby got points despite playing with Ouellet.
Thats what a 7.8 mil player does.

[gordphish]

Richards has Mono??
My son had it for a year and a half. You want to go into the playoffs with a guy with mono instead of Morrison? The first round pick will be worth more in three or four years and if you want to build for the future then I agree with you.
Heres another deal I might go with ; Richards for Morrison and Schneider.
The cap is a very important consideration and 7.8 is a huge hit.

We could probably debate this forever but I'm really looking forward to seeing what happens! If we do get Richards I hope you're right and Richards delivers the impact you expect from a 7.8 million dollar player.

Here is an interview with Nonis today :

http://www.nhl.tv/team/console?type=fvod&id=13160&catid=201

Richards had mono. As far as I've heard, he's over it.

[Matt Cooke]

Bye Cookie, we'll miss you buddy!!

Is Pettinger really an upgrade or just that contract assurance for next season?

[gordphish]

Bye Cookie, we'll miss you buddy!!

Is Pettinger really an upgrade or just that contract assurance for next season?

What assurance?

They'd have been better off dealing Cooke for a draft pick, or keeping him for the playoffs (if they get there) and then putting his 1.5 mil towards some scoring help in the summer.

A typical stupid sideways move that falls right in line with the old Quinn / Burke philosophy of only making trades when you absolutely have to.

Cooke was no longer welcome here, Pettinger wasn't wanted in Washington, so he swapped his headache for someone else's at the cost of 1 million per for a player with 7 big points this year. Well done.

At least he didn't hand away any more 2nd round picks for other people's garbage.

WHOOPEE!!!

[Nelson19777]

What assurance?

They'd have been better off dealing Cooke for a draft pick, or keeping him for the playoffs (if they get there) and then putting his 1.5 mil towards some scoring help in the summer.

A typical stupid sideways move that falls right in line with the old Quinn / Burke philosophy of only making trades when you absolutely have to.

Cooke was no longer welcome here, Pettinger wasn't wanted in Washington, so he swapped his headache for someone else's at the cost of 1 million per for a player with 7 big points this year. Well done.

At least he didn't hand away any more 2nd round picks for other people's garbage.

WHOOPEE!!!

Gordo that's almost optimistic! A week ago there was no hope for this team. Now they get a resounding "if". :laughing:

Agreed that this move was basically a waste of time. At least Cooke was one of the most hated agitators. I liked that. Pettinger is the same size had some higher point totals in previous years, but so had Cooke. Maybe the change will be good, but a sideways move is not what we needed. We need real scoring.

[gordphish]

Gordo that's almost optimistic! A week ago there was no hope for this team. Now they get a resounding "if". :laughing:

Agreed that this move was basically a waste of time. At least Cooke was one of the most hated agitators. I liked that. Pettinger is the same size had some higher point totals in previous years, but so had Cooke. Maybe the change will be good, but a sideways move is not what we needed. We need real scoring.

What really kills me is that now he has committed a million of their cap space for next year on yet ANOTHER bottom of the barrell, bottom 6 forward. A mean, what was the freaking point of that?

Yeah, Pettinger COULD score 25 goals, but this team is past the point of rolling the dice on previously failed experiments. It's window of opportunity to win with this group is closing fast.

As I've said in the past. Low risk deals get you low return. At best, this team gets them an INCH in the right direction.

[KB in Kelowna]

Anyone remember the poll question in another thread that said "Dave Nonis sits on his hands on draft day" or words to that effect? Cooke had his moments with this team. 2003 he took Bertuzzi's place on the WCE and he and Mo and Naslund played well amongst the turmoil, but for me the nail in the coffin was the "karma" play against Dallas last year. He tries a slew foot take out and does in his own knee, selfish and not necessary. I would have preferred a move to bring more offence, more scoring. Cowan, Burrows, Ritchie, and to a lesser degree Isbister do what Cooke did, agiatate and score once in a while. So who plays with Shannon and Raymond now?

[TimmyTabasco]

If you remember, I had suggested Pettinger..

He can skate, can hit, and has scored 20 goals before. Plus, last season he scored 16

Thats not bad..

Sure, he's not an impact player..but he will help the team

Obviously the price for a second line center was too high..or another team offered a better package. So, thats understandable

BUT..Nonis should have tried to land atleast a top six forward..and he failed to do so. Is he happy with Raymond, and Shannon? Looks like it

This team is desperate for a top six forward, despite the road back to winning

[Vanfan]

What really kills me is that now he has committed a million of their cap space for next year on yet ANOTHER bottom of the barrell, bottom 6 forward. A mean, what was the freaking point of that?

Yeah, Pettinger COULD score 25 goals, but this team is past the point of rolling the dice on previously failed experiments. It's window of opportunity to win with this group is closing fast.

As I've said in the past. Low risk deals get you low return. At best, this team gets them an INCH in the right direction.


I agree with you Gordphish:confused:

At least we didn't get worse :shrug: or give away any of our future for nothing.

The next few months should prove to be very interesting and I'll be cheering like hell for the Canucks. We definitely will need a few of the boys to step it up and earn their dough.

[rustybadcock]

If you remember, I had suggested Pettinger..

He can skate, can hit, and has scored 20 goals before. Plus, last season he scored 16

Thats not bad..

Sure, he's not an impact player..but he will help the team

Obviously the price for a second line center was too high..or another team offered a better package. So, thats understandable

BUT..Nonis should have tried to land atleast a top six forward..and he failed to do so. Is he happy with Raymond, and Shannon? Looks like it

This team is desperate for a top six forward, despite the road back to winning

You have mentioned him and I was going to if you hadn't brought that up...matter of fact, you've mentioned Pettinger more than once in the past if memory serves.

Yeah, I think people are really being negative about Pettinger. I mean, we traded a guy who was on his way out. What would people have preferred? A second round pick for Cooke? I think that would have been a greater gamble.

Pettinger has scored 20 goals in this league on a terrible team - that's secondary scoring isn't it? Put him in a solid line up and see what comes of it....I bet he fits our team fine. And at a half million less I like our chances and I also like that fact we got "something" for nothing....

I think Cooke pissed a lot of people off over the years, on and off this team. And without a doubt he lost his job to the ball hockey champ of the world in Burrows. And to boot, say what you will about Burrows but he at least drops the gloves when necessary and for my money, does an good job every time. Cooke smoked a lot of guys and nearly never answered the bell and it's glaringly obvious that never sat well with V - which I respect. Now Cookiemonster can go hide behind Brashear like in the good ole days.

Seems to me the only thing that was right was landing Richards. Funny too how even he wasn't good enough in the recent past. :rolleyes: There's just no winning that's all. This team will always be flawed, it's decisions will always be terrible and they will never be a winner according to some fans. Oh well I say. Nonis didn't pull the trigger and get Hossa or Jokinen or Richards....big deal. We still have a good team today and in the end, we simply didn't have enough to obviously satisfy Tbay. Smith is what they really coveted and Schneider just is too far away in his development to really have put us in contention for Richards. I accept that far more than I accept that Dave Nonis failed this team.

If every GM listened to some of this teams fan base and media representation much of what you cheer for today would have been traded long before Luongo's arrival. Especially the Twins. When I lived in Vancity the fans who truly saw what the Twins offer today back then were few and far between. Frankly, this team will never be good enough for many many of their supposed supporters.:slant:

Oh well, moving forward....being a big player on deadline day doesn't guarantee ones team a trip to the dance. Sometimes it's a bigger sign of weakness IMO...

RB

[Vanfan]

Well put Rusty:thumb:

[KB in Kelowna]

You have mentioned him and I was going to if you hadn't brought that up...matter of fact, you've mentioned Pettinger more than once in the past if memory serves.

Yeah, I think people are really being negative about Pettinger. I mean, we traded a guy who was on his way out. What would people have preferred? A second round pick for Cooke? I think that would have been a greater gamble.

Pettinger has scored 20 goals in this league on a terrible team - that's secondary scoring isn't it? Put him in a solid line up and see what comes of it....I bet he fits our team fine. And at a half million less I like our chances and I also like that fact we got "something" for nothing....

I think Cooke pissed a lot of people off over the years, on and off this team. And without a doubt he lost his job to the ball hockey champ of the world in Burrows. And to boot, say what you will about Burrows but he at least drops the gloves when necessary and for my money, does an good job every time. Cooke smoked a lot of guys and nearly never answered the bell and it's glaringly obvious that never sat well with V - which I respect. Now Cookiemonster can go hide behind Brashear like in the good ole days.

Seems to me the only thing that was right was landing Richards. Funny too how even he wasn't good enough in the recent past. :rolleyes: There's just no winning that's all. This team will always be flawed, it's decisions will always be terrible and they will never be a winner according to some fans. Oh well I say. Nonis didn't pull the trigger and get Hossa or Jokinen or Richards....big deal. We still have a good team today and in the end, we simply didn't have enough to obviously satisfy Tbay. Smith is what they really coveted and Schneider just is too far away in his development to really have put us in contention for Richards. I accept that far more than I accept that Dave Nonis failed this team.

If every GM listened to some of this teams fan base and media representation much of what you cheer for today would have been traded long before Luongo's arrival. Especially the Twins. When I lived in Vancity the fans who truly saw what the Twins offer today back then were few and far between. Frankly, this team will never be good enough for many many of their supposed supporters.:slant:

Oh well, moving forward....being a big player on deadline day doesn't guarantee ones team a trip to the dance. Sometimes it's a bigger sign of weakness IMO...

RB
Nice to see you popping back in RB. :thumb:

It can be tough sticking with a team through thick and thin especially when you see patterns constanly re-emerging. But stick with them you do. It is possible to be a fan and not always drink the Kool-Aid.

On the whole they get a younger player with a better upside. They had not made Cooke an offer form next season, so at least they turned a depreciating asset into something, which given this team's history has not always been the case.

[gordphish]

You have mentioned him and I was going to if you hadn't brought that up...matter of fact, you've mentioned Pettinger more than once in the past if memory serves.

Yeah, I think people are really being negative about Pettinger. I mean, we traded a guy who was on his way out. What would people have preferred? A second round pick for Cooke? I think that would have been a greater gamble.

Pettinger has scored 20 goals in this league on a terrible team - that's secondary scoring isn't it? Put him in a solid line up and see what comes of it....I bet he fits our team fine. And at a half million less I like our chances and I also like that fact we got "something" for nothing....

I think Cooke pissed a lot of people off over the years, on and off this team. And without a doubt he lost his job to the ball hockey champ of the world in Burrows. And to boot, say what you will about Burrows but he at least drops the gloves when necessary and for my money, does an good job every time. Cooke smoked a lot of guys and nearly never answered the bell and it's glaringly obvious that never sat well with V - which I respect. Now Cookiemonster can go hide behind Brashear like in the good ole days.

Seems to me the only thing that was right was landing Richards. Funny too how even he wasn't good enough in the recent past. :rolleyes: There's just no winning that's all. This team will always be flawed, it's decisions will always be terrible and they will never be a winner according to some fans. Oh well I say. Nonis didn't pull the trigger and get Hossa or Jokinen or Richards....big deal. We still have a good team today and in the end, we simply didn't have enough to obviously satisfy Tbay. Smith is what they really coveted and Schneider just is too far away in his development to really have put us in contention for Richards. I accept that far more than I accept that Dave Nonis failed this team.

If every GM listened to some of this teams fan base and media representation much of what you cheer for today would have been traded long before Luongo's arrival. Especially the Twins. When I lived in Vancity the fans who truly saw what the Twins offer today back then were few and far between. Frankly, this team will never be good enough for many many of their supposed supporters.:slant:

Oh well, moving forward....being a big player on deadline day doesn't guarantee ones team a trip to the dance. Sometimes it's a bigger sign of weakness IMO...

RB

For me, it was all or nothing with Richards. I didn't see another player out there that was worth them giving up a quality package for...however, I'd like to know what the offer was, and whether or not upgrading Bourdon to Bieksa would have made the difference.

As for what they did do, I'd rather they have taken the 2nd round pick and free up the cap space. Why is comitting a million of their cap space to another 3rd line forward a good thing at this point? Maybe had Pettinger been UFA at the end of the year, I could see it. But that cap space should be going towards a legitimate top 6 scorer next summer, period. It was a stupid move ala Park ala Chouinard ala Cowan ala Ritchie ala Isbister etc etc etc till the cows come home to f**king roost.

I hear on the Team 1040 this afternoon that Tambellini basically told them that Nonis has been trying hard to get a top 6 forward since last July. So the will is there, the effort is there...BUT NO ABILITY to get a deal done. How does make the rest you guys in the peanut gallery feel about your GM? How is that going to change over the summer or at the next trade deadline?
I suppose it hasn't occurred to anybody else that the other GMs look at Dave Nonis and see a guy that hosed Florida in the Luongo deal, and now expect him to ante up big in the next impact deal he makes to even things out? If Nonis doesn't get that and isn't prepared to meet the other GMs demands at some point, even if it amounts to an overpayment, he'll be waiting until Luongo and the Sedins are collecting their old age pensions.

Now. I'll digress and reiterate. Once Richards was gone, I didn't see another deal out there that I wanted Nonis to make. But that doesn't mean I'm not pissed as hell. When was the last time any of you remember this team making a deal for an impact player when they were in a position to contend? 1994 doesn't count because that team was .500 and flirting with the last playoff spot all season. Stumped? NEVER, that's when. I'm just getting sick and f**king tired of ALWAYS being the team that is sitting on the outside looking in. EVERY f**king trade deadline, EVERY f**king free agent period, Every f**king year, year in and year f**king out.

I can only point this out so many times. In the history of the NHL, there have only been two teams not in the top 6 overall standings go on to win the Stanley Cup. New Jersey in 95 that finished 9th doesn't really count because of the lockout, and the MARIO LEMIEUX lead Pittsburgh Penguins in 91 that finished 7th is the exception that proves the rule. IF THEY DO NOT FINISH IN TOP 6 OF THE OVERALL STANDINGS, THEY WILL NOT WIN THE STANLEY CUP. Luongo can outplay every other goalie in playoff history, AND THEY WILL NOT WIN THE STANLEY CUP. The Sedins can break both break the playoff scoring record AND THEY WILL NOT WIN THE STANLEY CUP. Every other team in the playoffs could die in airplane crashes, AND THEY WILL NOT WIN THE STANLEY CUP.

This team needs an elite second line centre to break that top 6 in the standings. PERIOD. Depending on the development of Raymond, they may need another top 6 winger as well. If they do not get those things this summer while still holding on to Markus Naslund's 30 goals, they may as well blow this group up because it's time will have passed.

And I have been consistent in that view since they blew the 3-1 lead to Dallas last spring. It isn't that nothing is good enough for me, it is that doing nothing is not good enough. The Shark that circles it's prey waiting for the precisely perfect time to strike most often ends up dining on old tires and starving to death.

[rustybadcock]

Well guys, I hear all of you. And basically see your points. Gordo, I see how frustrating this journey must be, you've been on the path for 30 some years. That's enough to land you in Riverview.

KB, I am an ex Jet fan, believe me bro, I don't always suck back the koolaid man. I guess I just see for once a decent bunch. They remind me of the Calgary team of 04 in SOME ways. Figured I'd better say SOME before I get fed my lunch. :laughing: I see a hard working blue collar bunch that, like many before them, need timing and luck to collide for them to move deep into the playoffs.

Look at Detroit. One could argue they too have no secondary scoring. Their D is in rough shape. They landed one guy, Stuart, which will hurt them more than help I predict. I am just not sold on his value. Anyway...

I think what mostly brought on my post was I sat there watching this day, while fighting a flu and felt the same let down when the Richards thing worked it's way out in Dallas as Gordo mentioned. I was disappointed big time cause I really saw an opportunity with him. However, after the dust settled I think it's fair to say they wanted Goaltending....Dallas won the prize. I am also seriously let down by the van media. They phucking suck and deserve no one's respect. I mean Gary Valk was basically crying in his beer like his boy friend was traded for someone whom might not like HIM....:no: :slant: :rolleyes: If it wasn't for Ray Ferarro I'm not sure anyone could have seen the light of day.

It's done, we have what we have. Sit back, relax and pour a cup of (wall is suddenly bashed in by giant juice jug) "Oh yeah.....:coffee:

It is what it is....

RB

[gordphish]

OK, let's look at it from another POV...

Let's say they get healthy and stay healthy, pull a Calgary from 04 and take the Penguins to the 7th game in the Final. They lose 3 of 4, including the 7th game, by one goal. Now we all scream about how if they had of just picked up one more top 6 scorer they would have won the Stanley Cup, knowing full well that it will likely take another 15 years before they get back there again.

[TimmyTabasco]

Well, its too bad they couldn't add what they wanted to add

Its rumoured that Nonis was in the running for T. Ruutu, and Ryder. But, he was outbid for Ruutu, and Gainey decided to hang onto Ryder(since he failed on Hossa)

So, do the Canucks look to the trade front(during the off-season)?..or do they go the UFA route?

Besides Langkow..not much is available at center..or much at all

[AtLossForWords]

Well, its too bad they couldn't add what they wanted to add

Its rumoured that Nonis was in the running for T. Ruutu, and Ryder. But, he was outbid for Ruutu, and Gainey decided to hang onto Ryder(since he failed on Hossa)

So, do the Canucks look to the trade front(during the off-season)?..or do they go the UFA route?

Besides Langkow..not much is available at center..or much at all

I think you'll see Nonis sign a couple cheap blueliners in the off season, and then he'll peddle Bieksa in a package to Florida for Olli Jokinen.

Langkow would be an excellent pickup as well. He can score goals and play a tough game. I think Badcock would go nuts to see him in a Jets sweater.

[gordphish]

Well, its too bad they couldn't add what they wanted to add

Its rumoured that Nonis was in the running for T. Ruutu, and Ryder. But, he was outbid for Ruutu, and Gainey decided to hang onto Ryder(since he failed on Hossa)

So, do the Canucks look to the trade front(during the off-season)?..or do they go the UFA route?

Besides Langkow..not much is available at center..or much at all

Outbid by Andrew Ladd, huh? What was he offering? Brad Isbister's shorts?

[TimmyTabasco]

Outbid by Andrew Ladd, huh? What was he offering? Brad Isbister's shorts?

:laughing:

Yes, perhaps

But hey..Ruutu and Ladd were both high profile picks

And, both have failed to live up to expectations

I'm sure Ruutu will thrive in the gentle Eastern Conference

[gordphish]

I think you'll see Nonis sign a couple cheap blueliners in the off season, and then he'll peddle Bieksa in a package to Florida for Olli Jokinen.

Langkow would be an excellent pickup as well. He can score goals and play a tough game. I think Badcock would go nuts to see him in a Jets sweater.

First we'll get Nonis at the draft proclaiming that he tried to move up with several teams, but no one was really interested, so he'll look to July 1st.

Then we'll see Nonis resign Naslund, Ritchie, Morrison and maybe Miller (or a reasonable facsimile).

Then in a few weeks he'll give us the same old rhetoric about how he talked to UFAs, but that there was nothing out there that made sense, and he's looking for a trade.

And then right about the last week of July, he'll say that he can't force other GMs to deal, he made a few offers that he thought were good enough but no one bit, and that they're ready to go into camp looking to plug the holes from within. After all, he'll say, he has a middle of the road offense, and if you look at New Jersey in the east, they've done just fine with similar scoring.

And then during camp he'll invite one or two reclamation projects from Europe to camp, and maybe pluck some fourth liner that couldn't stick with the Kings or Panthers off the waiver wire.

In fact, I think you can set your offseason calendar by all of that.

[AtLossForWords]

Well that does seem to be the Nonis method, so who are you going to ask to run the team next season, Trevor Linden? Well that might not be the worst bet in the world considering he has managerial experience from being high up in the players association, and most people in the league may like him enough to make a deal with him so when he makes an offer someone might bite.

I tend to question ownership when they have a GM who isn't helping them make money and isn't putting them on the winning track.

Dallas got rid of Doug Armstrong in the middle of the season since they didn't like what he had done with his team. Ottawa got rid of Muckler because the 2nd round wasn't enough. This team's ownership is too complacent with who's running the team.

[gordphish]

Well that does seem to be the Nonis method, so who are you going to ask to run the team next season, Trevor Linden? Well that might not be the worst bet in the world considering he has managerial experience from being high up in the players association, and most people in the league may like him enough to make a deal with him so when he makes an offer someone might bite.

I tend to question ownership when they have a GM who isn't helping them make money and isn't putting them on the winning track.

Dallas got rid of Doug Armstrong in the middle of the season since they didn't like what he had done with his team. Ottawa got rid of Muckler because the 2nd round wasn't enough. This team's ownership is too complacent with who's running the team.

I think Linden would be a terrible choice. I think he alienated a large part of the PA with what happened during the lockout.

If they did fire Nonis, ownership would probably replace him with Tambellini. Would he be an improvement, I don't know.

[AtLossForWords]

I think Linden would be a terrible choice. I think he alienated a large part of the PA with what happened during the lockout.

If they did fire Nonis, ownership would probably replace him with Tambellini. Would he be an improvement, I don't know.

Tambellini would give us the same rhetoric that there were no takers for deals and he did all he could do to improve the team and follow his old boss' plan to stick it to ownership with a core that just won't win.

[gordphish]

Tambellini would give us the same rhetoric that there were no takers for deals and he did all he could do to improve the team and follow his old boss' plan to stick it to ownership with a core that just won't win.

Yeah, probably. :slant:

[AtLossForWords]

Here's a hockey trade four you.

To Chicago
Kevin Bieksa
Cory Schnieder
1st Round Pick

To Vancouver
Dustin Byfuglien
Jason Williams

What do we get when we give up that much? A big powerforward who is a smart net prescence with a good shot, along with a guy who shines in the shootout and has a good accurate shot that works a powerplay well.

[grim]

Ottawa got rid of Muckler because the 2nd round wasn't enough.

No... we got rid of Mucky because he is old. But he could still count up the four rounds. We finally found him wandering around in his underwear in the snow with a lucrative contract in one hand and a pen in the other hand looking for Steve Shields. It was time for the car ride.

[TimmyTabasco]

Here's a hockey trade four you.

To Chicago
Kevin Bieksa
Cory Schnieder
1st Round Pick

To Vancouver
Dustin Byfuglien
Jason Williams

What do we get when we give up that much? A big powerforward who is a smart net prescence with a good shot, along with a guy who shines in the shootout and has a good accurate shot that works a powerplay well.

I like the idea of Dustin Byfuglien. He seems to be a good young player. Plus, he could be expendable due to the acquisition of Ladd. Also, Williams has been playing well..and would help the PP

But, why would they want Bieksa? They already have a pretty decent blueline. If somehow you could include Seabrook, and send another player to the Hawks..it would be pretty solid

[TimmyTabasco]

Goddamn, typed out a decent post..but didn't copy it! Timed out...

Anyway..smaller version

UFA forwards the Canucks should look at

-Langkow
-Ryder
-Vrbata
-Brunette
-Kelly(tip to Badcock), but only if they waive or buy-out Cowan
-Jason Williams(found out he's a UFA)
-Rolston
-Fedotenko


UFA defenseman to look at

-Montador
-Kalinin
-Streit(but not sure how he would fit)
-Hainsey

Campbell would be nice, but also too expensive

UFA goaltenders

-Sanford
-Hedberg

Pretty sure we could re-sign Sanford. If not, Hiller from Burke would be alright

Now, onto the RFA Forwards

-Carter(Nonis should make a serious run at this guy)
-Erat
-Byfuglien(thanks to Lossy, a very good idea)
-Kobasew(but will he still produce?)
-Clowe(is it worth the risk?)


Now, for the RFA defenseman

-Ehrhoff
If the Sharks re-sign campbell, he could be available. Last year had a good season, decent PP defenseman

Anyway, a shorter version..but gets the point across..

[AtLossForWords]

I think you could get rights to Byfuglien easier than most might think in Chicago. Sure he has 16 goals and brings some intangibles, but I don't know how he fits into their puzzle.

If they give Byfuglien too much money, it will handicap them in keeping Toews, Kane, Seabrook, Keith, and Barker all of whom they are really high on. They just extended Sharp this well and have some more money they need to pay Havlat.

I say Chicago would want Bieksa, because rumor has it they were interested in getting Campbell and signing him at the deadline. They want a younger, but more seasoned veterean blueliner on their team. I feel that Bieksa having at least a year of playoff experience will be seen as a stabalizing influence in Chicago. After all these guys consider Brent Sopel to stabalize their blueline. Bieksa would be a huge upgrade.

Then again, you could alway just sign Byfuglien to an offer sheet and give Chicago back picks.

Byfuglien is a guy I feel can take the Sedins to the next level. He hits hard, plays a really mean game, and along with being a net prescence, he has a rocket shot.

[gordphish]

I think you could get rights to Byfuglien easier than most might think in Chicago. Sure he has 16 goals and brings some intangibles, but I don't know how he fits into their puzzle.

If they give Byfuglien too much money, it will handicap them in keeping Toews, Kane, Seabrook, Keith, and Barker all of whom they are really high on. They just extended Sharp this well and have some more money they need to pay Havlat.

I say Chicago would want Bieksa, because rumor has it they were interested in getting Campbell and signing him at the deadline. They want a younger, but more seasoned veterean blueliner on their team. I feel that Bieksa having at least a year of playoff experience will be seen as a stabalizing influence in Chicago. After all these guys consider Brent Sopel to stabalize their blueline. Bieksa would be a huge upgrade.

Then again, you could alway just sign Byfuglien to an offer sheet and give Chicago back picks.

Byfuglien is a guy I feel can take the Sedins to the next level. He hits hard, plays a really mean game, and along with being a net prescence, he has a rocket shot.

I don't think you are going to see the Hawks give up on any of their young players just for the sake of making salary room. They only spent 33 mil this year and only have 29 mil committed for next season. And they only have to wait until after next season and they get Havlat, Lang and Khabibulin's combined 17 mil off their books.

Now that's not to say Talon wouldn't make a hockey move he felt would improve his team, but he isn't in the position where he has to start dumping young players to make cap space yet.

From everything I've heard, they are also pretty high on this Byfuglien in Chicago, and he's become a fan favourite to boot.

[TimmyTabasco]

I think you could get rights to Byfuglien easier than most might think in Chicago. Sure he has 16 goals and brings some intangibles, but I don't know how he fits into their puzzle.

If they give Byfuglien too much money, it will handicap them in keeping Toews, Kane, Seabrook, Keith, and Barker all of whom they are really high on. They just extended Sharp this well and have some more money they need to pay Havlat.

I say Chicago would want Bieksa, because rumor has it they were interested in getting Campbell and signing him at the deadline. They want a younger, but more seasoned veterean blueliner on their team. I feel that Bieksa having at least a year of playoff experience will be seen as a stabalizing influence in Chicago. After all these guys consider Brent Sopel to stabalize their blueline. Bieksa would be a huge upgrade.

Then again, you could alway just sign Byfuglien to an offer sheet and give Chicago back picks.

Byfuglien is a guy I feel can take the Sedins to the next level. He hits hard, plays a really mean game, and along with being a net prescence, he has a rocket shot.

Yeah, I didn't know he was a defenseman. Is he playing both positions?

The Canucks could offer him a 1.9 million offer sheet, and see what happens. Sure, it would be a gamble..but it would probably pay off

Also, about Jason Williams. Would we see the Williams from Chicago, or the guy from the wings? None the less would be an interesting name

[KB in Kelowna]

I like what I have seen from Byfuglien, so try an offer sheet. As for some other names no more reclamation projects please.

[TimmyTabasco]

I like what I have seen from Byfuglien, so try an offer sheet. As for some other names no more reclamation projects please.

Yeah..desperate times I guess..so an offer sheet would work