View Full Version : Sheldon Souray... flash in the pan?
In 2003-2004, Souray made the all-star team having a break through season, and some dared calling him a flash in the pan. Even earlier this season, when Souray was dealing with personal problems, a nasty divorce and battle to see his daughter, while trying to adjust to the "new NHL", the same people were claiming that they were right... WRONG!
03-04: 15G 20A 35PTS
05-06: 10G 24A 34PTS and there are still 8 games left!
How's the crow? http://smileys.sur-la-toile.com/repository/Combat/0211.gif
wildboy26
4-02-06, 6:17 PM
He split with his playgirl wife, poor guy, give the guy a break. :)
TimmyTabasco
4-04-06, 11:29 AM
I have always been a proud supporter of Souray.
As noted, he had a rough start, and personal problems to start the season. However, since Gainey came onboard as coach..he turned his game around.
So now, where are the doubters? :D
KB in Kelowna
4-04-06, 6:18 PM
In 2003-2004, Souray made the all-star team having a break through season, and some dared calling him a flash in the pan. Even earlier this season, when Souray was dealing with personal problems, a nasty divorce and battle to see his daughter, while trying to adjust to the "new NHL", the same people were claiming that they were right... WRONG!
03-04: 15G 20A 35PTS
05-06: 10G 24A 34PTS and there are still 8 games left!
How's the crow? http://smileys.sur-la-toile.com/repository/Combat/0211.gif
you forgot to mention his time with the Kelowna Rockets :nod:
Newfie John
4-04-06, 6:41 PM
He's nowhere close to as good defensively as he was in his flash in the pan year. He's playing on a better team right now, IMO, which inflates his assist total and he only has 10 goals.
He's not Norris quality which Hab fans were raving him as back in 03-04.
TimmyTabasco
4-04-06, 7:09 PM
He's nowhere close to as good defensively as he was in his flash in the pan year. He's playing on a better team right now, IMO, which inflates his assist total and he only has 10 goals.
He's not Norris quality which Hab fans were raving him as back in 03-04.
Come On :laughing:
Souray has improved under Gainey, and totally turned his season around.
He is not a flash in the pan, and thats the point :D
KB in Kelowna
4-04-06, 8:48 PM
He's nowhere close to as good defensively as he was in his flash in the pan year. He's playing on a better team right now, IMO, which inflates his assist total and he only has 10 goals.
He's not Norris quality which Hab fans were raving him as back in 03-04.
Yea, watch those guys who have fans promoting thier Norris chances before the season is finished;)
Newfie John
4-04-06, 8:50 PM
Yea, watch those guys who have fans promoting thier Norris chances before the season is finished;)
Mccabe has a chance to win it, but thats another story.
charlio lemieux
4-04-06, 10:43 PM
Mccabe has a chance to win it, but thats another story.
I think John it should be "had a chance to win it".:D
When he was over a PPG and leading the other D-men in the league by 10 points, ya, he was a serious candidate.
But now, realistically it is going to go to Lidstrom.
Mccabe has a chance to win it, but thats another story.
Souray's in the playoffs... :thumb:
He's nowhere close to as good defensively as he was in his flash in the pan year. He's playing on a better team right now, IMO, which inflates his assist total and he only has 10 goals.
Have you watched him play? Come on with the excuses... He's having as good of a season as ever. Tonight again, he dropped the gloves and gave what's-his-face in Boston a lickin' for kneeing Ryder! Great leader, he's playing some of the best hockey of his career! :shrug:
Newfie John
4-05-06, 6:18 AM
Souray's in the playoffs... :thumb:
What does that have to do with anything?
Newfie John
4-05-06, 6:21 AM
Have you watched him play? Come on with the excuses... He's having as good of a season as ever. Tonight again, he dropped the gloves and gave what's-his-face in Boston a lickin' for kneeing Ryder! Great leader, he's playing some of the best hockey of his career! :shrug:
Tie Domi does what you explained here. Should he be lining up for the heart trophy?
I've watched him play( I have RDS). He makes a lot of defensive mistakes, and I think his assist count is bloated. He only has 10 goals. Also, this is in the new NHL where scoring is up, especially for defencemen. Souray is below his 03-04 pace, even with the fact that the rules help defencemen's point totals.
TimmyTabasco
4-05-06, 11:11 AM
Tie Domi does what you explained here. Should he be lining up for the heart trophy?
I've watched him play( I have RDS). He makes a lot of defensive mistakes, and I think his assist count is bloated. He only has 10 goals. Also, this is in the new NHL where scoring is up, especially for defencemen. Souray is below his 03-04 pace, even with the fact that the rules help defencemen's point totals.
Give it a rest
Souray has proven he is not a flash in the pan. You can argue his assist total is bloated. But, the fact is..he has assists.
Wow, only 10 goals. Well, Zubov has 12 goals..and this is the new NHL..I suppose his assists are also bloated? Hell, Niedermayer has 12 goals..a big two more than Souray..in the new NHL..when scoring is up. And, no..Souray is not as good as the above mentioned..
BTW, Last night he had an assist, to tie his career high in points with 35 :thumb:
capebretoncanadien
4-17-06, 9:40 AM
He's cool...he had a somewhat shaky start but has rebounded to put together a very respectable season....he's got 38 points (his career high) and what's this talk of 'bloated' assist numbers? That's ridiculous! What does that even mean. How can your points total be bloated? Last time I checked he's not playing wing alongside Gretzky or Lemieux. Newf...........you're WRONG:talkhand:
TimmyTabasco
4-17-06, 2:49 PM
He's cool...he had a somewhat shaky start but has rebounded to put together a very respectable season....he's got 38 points (his career high) and what's this talk of 'bloated' assist numbers? That's ridiculous! What does that even mean. How can your points total be bloated? Last time I checked he's not playing wing alongside Gretzky or Lemieux. Newf...........you're WRONG:talkhand:
Its great to see Souray prove the critics wrong
:D
03-04: 15G 20A 35PTS
05-06: 12G 27A 39PTS (career high)
So for those who don't remember, some were saying at the end of the 03-04 season that Souray was a flash-in-the-pan, that he would never have a season like that again...
I like when people make comments like that as it's really fun to prove them wrong isn't it? :wicked:
And in the playoffs, he had 3 goals and 2 assists for 5 points in... 6 games! The flash-in-the-pan label is now off for good! :soapbox:
Newfie John
5-07-06, 8:06 PM
Season Team GP G A P +/- PIM PP SH GW GT Shots Pct
2005-2006 Canadiens 75 12 27 39 -11 116 7 1 0 0 202 5.9
2003-2004 Canadiens 63 15 20 35 4 104 6 1 3 0 186 8.1
Souray played 12 more games this season, had 3 less goals then he did in 04. He did have a few more points, mostly because of a bloated assist count. Not to mention is clumsy D. It's easy to see he slowed down and will continue to slow down. Textbook flash in the pan. He'll never reach the PPG he had in 04.
wildboy26
5-07-06, 8:37 PM
Hopefully Markov and he will both want to be recognized as the top dog on D in Montreal and will push each other next year. For this year Markov has really emerged and has, for now, far surpassed Souray in Montreal.
TimmyTabasco
5-07-06, 11:14 PM
Season Team GP G A P +/- PIM PP SH GW GT Shots Pct
2005-2006 Canadiens 75 12 27 39 -11 116 7 1 0 0 202 5.9
2003-2004 Canadiens 63 15 20 35 4 104 6 1 3 0 186 8.1
Souray played 12 more games this season, had 3 less goals then he did in 04. He did have a few more points, mostly because of a bloated assist count. Not to mention is clumsy D. It's easy to see he slowed down and will continue to slow down. Textbook flash in the pan. He'll never reach the PPG he had in 04.
Johnny,
Give it a rest :thumb:
I'll post this here as Matt (Mel) isn't as anal as an admin elsewhere...
Nothing like dusting off an old thread before serving crow...
The "flash in the pan" Souray is doing it again... Guess who's leading the league in defensemen in goals and in points? Wasn't that guy supposed to fade two years ago?
7 games played, 5 goals, 4 assists, 9 points! That flash is looking more like a fire to me.
Oh and Markov has 7 points in as many games.
In my honest humble opinion he is a marginaly good/fair dman.
I wouldn't be trumpeting him after less than ten games into the season, how many times have we seen a player light it up in Sept/Oct only to see them flop when the season got hot and heavy.
Don't forget J, McCabe led the league d scoring for sometime last year.
slapshot™
10-22-06, 6:12 PM
Don't forget J, McCabe led the league d scoring for sometime last year.
McCabe was considered as a flash-in-the-pan? Always gotta go back to the Leaf-speak, eh Rusty?
McCabe was considered as a flash-in-the-pan? Always gotta go back to the Leaf-speak, eh Rusty?
At first I was going to delete that, but seeing as I am in the middle of a week of 12 hour night shifts my tired old mind forgot!
You should have seen what I did delete!!!!
:wicked:
KB in Kelowna
10-22-06, 6:43 PM
Wow deja vu:boogie:
In my honest humble opinion he is a marginaly good/fair dman.
I wouldn't be trumpeting him after less than ten games into the season, how many times have we seen a player light it up in Sept/Oct only to see them flop when the season got hot and heavy.
Don't forget J, McCabe led the league d scoring for sometime last year.
I understand what you're saying Rusty and I'm certainly not gloating after 7 games, but a guy has to take his shots when he can! According to some comments made two seasons ago, Souray's performances which saw him get an invite to the All-Star game were simply that he was a flash in the pan. I simply wanted to follow-up on that by stating that he then went on to have his best career season the following year and he's doing even better in this early season. He won't win the Norris, he does have his weaknesses, but one needs to serve the crow when it's warm, out of the oven! ;) :D
Wow deja vu:boogie:
Hey I found a place to post this where freedom of speech isn't controled by blue and white dictatorship! :nod: :boogie:
KB in Kelowna
10-22-06, 10:12 PM
Hey I found a place to post this where freedom of speech isn't controled by blue and white dictatorship! :nod: :boogie:
You know me I am always happy when ex-Kelowna Rockets do well :thumb:
I also don't make all star team or end of season hardware predictions in
October, or the first six weeks of any season either.;)
charlio lemieux
10-22-06, 11:26 PM
I'd rather have Markov.
TimmyTabasco
10-23-06, 1:29 PM
I'll post this here as Matt (Mel) isn't as anal as an admin elsewhere...
Joce, that hurts :cry: :D
Anyway, we both know that Souray is a very good defenseman
So, this is really no surprise
TimmyTabasco
10-23-06, 1:30 PM
I'd rather have Markov.
Yeah, Markov is most excellent
But, I'd rather have both :D
I'll post this here as Matt (Mel) isn't as anal as an admin elsewhere...I don't find Mel anal at all to tell you the truth..
slapshot™
10-24-06, 12:20 AM
Why don't you girls bicker over at that OTHER site you keep referring to and when you're here keep to the hockey talk.
Asterix
10-24-06, 12:58 AM
Joce, that hurts :cry: :D
Anyway, we both know that Souray is a very good defenseman
So, this is really no surprise
I think you know me better than that TT... :D
Asterix
10-24-06, 12:59 AM
Why don't you girls bicker over at that OTHER site you keep referring to and when you're here keep to the hockey talk.
I could do that but does that mean that I'd have to give you back your skirt? :laughing:
THE HACK
10-24-06, 3:03 PM
Well in the new weekly NHL honours for "3 stars of the week" Mr.Sheldon Souray was named the 3rd star of the week,congrats!:) If he can stay healthy he'll have another productive year.He'll probably never win a Norris trophy but I consider him to be at the top of a crop of 2nd tier defencemen like McCabe,Redden,Jovo and so on.That being said I'd love to have Souray on the Leafs.
Cheers
I thought that the definition of flash in the pan was one season wonder? Come on NJ, I want to see you admit that you were wrong! :thumb:
Seriously, second All-Star appearance for Souray and in half a season, he broke a Habs' record for most PP goals in a season for a defenseman... that from a team who saw the likes of Hall-of-Famers Doug Harvey, Serge Savard, Guy Lapointe and Larry Robinson, just to name a few! :eek:
The guy has gone through hell with his wrist on which he got several surgeries. He busted his butt to get to where he's at now and I'm thrilled to see him succeed, even if it could mean that we may not be able to sign him back next years as he's scheduled to become a UFA and he will draw a lot of attention from many teams...
Perhaps the thread title should be changed from Souray Flash in the pan to the Montreal Canadiens, Flash in the pan. What happened??? They were on such a high a few weeks ago????
wildboy26
2-12-07, 9:14 AM
The Canadiens are not doing a well because:
-Cristobal Huet should have skipped the all star game he got invited too. He is too old and crotchedy to stay fit without taking that needed all star break and it is showing.
-Sergei Samsanov is being mistreated, he was dumped to the 4th line for Latendresse earlier in the year and that started a chain of things and people wonder why he isnt living up to his salary by scoring more goals
-Higgins is not playing as well as he was before his injury
-the defense have gotten lazy and is hurting the team
KB in Kelowna
2-12-07, 10:25 PM
-Sergei Samsanov is being mistreated, he was dumped to the 4th line for Latendresse earlier in the year and that started a chain of things and people wonder why he isnt living up to his salary by scoring more goals
And yet you are willing to throw other players under a bus if they don't perform as advertised, or to your expectations?:conspire:
charlio lemieux
2-13-07, 6:57 AM
The Canadiens are not doing a well because:
-Sergei Samsanov is being mistreated, he was dumped to the 4th line for Latendresse earlier in the year and that started a chain of things and people wonder why he isnt living up to his salary by scoring more goals
Samsonov isn't being mistreated. He hasn't earned any ice-time. The guy had oodles of potential and talent but he doesn't care about anything but his paycheck. He had his opportunity early on and blew it.
He is the poster-child for why every contract should be atleast 50% performance bonuses.
Perhaps the thread title should be changed from Souray Flash in the pan to the Montreal Canadiens, Flash in the pan. What happened??? They were on such a high a few weeks ago????
Sorry but you should know better but to take threads off-topic. :doh:
What about that Souray guy! He'll be getting the jackpot next year, wherever he signs. To those who were calling him a flash in the pan, how the crow? :boogie:
Sheldon Souray scored last night against the New York Rangers his 19th PP goal, his 26th on the season, breaking a record held by Denis Potvin and Adrian Aucoin of 18 PP goals in a season for a defenseman.
In 80 games this season, he now has an amazing 26 goals and 37 assists for 63 points, placing 4th in the NHL is scoring amongst defensemen, while being an All-Star for the second time in 3 years.
So it's 3 years ago that he was called a flash-in-the-pan... how long before we can start serving the crow? I found a few ways to serve it! :nod:
The virtual way
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v177/JLpics/eatcrow4.jpg
Straight
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v177/JLpics/eatcrow3.jpg
With lime and side spinach
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v177/JLpics/eatcrow2.jpg
Well done with a fork and knife
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v177/JLpics/eatcrow.jpg
KB in Kelowna
4-06-07, 4:19 PM
Sheldon Souray scored last night against the New York Rangers his 19th PP goal, his 26th on the season, breaking a record held by Denis Potvin and Adrian Aucoin of 18 PP goals in a season for a defenseman.
In 80 games this season, he now has an amazing 26 goals and 37 assists for 63 points, placing 4th in the NHL is scoring amongst defensemen, while being an All-Star for the second time in 3 years.
So it's 3 years ago that he was called a flash-in-the-pan... how long before we can start serving the crow? I found a few ways to serve it! :nod:
The virtual way
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v177/JLpics/eatcrow4.jpg
Straight
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v177/JLpics/eatcrow3.jpg
With lime and side spinach
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v177/JLpics/eatcrow2.jpg
Well done with a fork and knife
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v177/JLpics/eatcrow.jpg
What are you suggesting the Crow be washed down with? Screech? Big Rock beer? :wicked: :laughing:
Newfie John
4-06-07, 6:35 PM
wildboy hacked into my account when that thread started...
wildboy hacked into my account when that thread started...
I see... he/she must have also hacked into your account at "the other place" as well... :soapbox:
Come on Johnnyboy, admit your mistakes... you were young, you were drunk, she said she was of age... Ooops, wrong topic! :thumb:
What are you suggesting the Crow be washed down with? Screech? Big Rock beer? :wicked: :laughing:
By the looks of it, it's a little whine! LMAO!
KB in Kelowna
4-07-07, 2:44 PM
Come on Johnnyboy, admit your mistakes... you were young, you were drunk, she said she was of age... Ooops, wrong topic! :thumb:
You forgot to add, she was dressed like a woman...:wicked: :razz: :rollover: :rollover:
You have to love former Kelowna Rockets!
Well he'll most likely sign a huge contract elsewhere in the off season, based off this season, ala Bryan McCabe and then revert back to flash in the pan status.
Okay a defencman has a -28 plus/minus rating but because he has scored a few power play goals that makes him great?
Call me stupid but I wouldn't hand over 5 mill for this guy with a propensity to score when you have the man advantage when the time you don't is much longer and all the more important. And to top it off he is a career plus/minus rating of -29!
Newfie John
4-08-07, 2:20 PM
I still think Souray is overrated, but yes okay, I was wrong. He wasn't a flash in the pan.
The fact remains though, the Leafs won last night.. hehe
The fact remains though, the Leafs won last night.. hehe
And it did them no good with the Isles winning over the Devils. After losing DiPietro and coming from behind like that in the standings New York deserved the spot over both Toronto and Montreal. Good on them.
Ryder cemented himself as a big-game player in my book last night. Great game from the Newfoundlander.
Newfie John
4-08-07, 8:09 PM
And it did them no good with the Isles winning over the Devils. After losing DiPietro and coming from behind like that in the standings New York deserved the spot over both Toronto and Montreal. Good on them.
Ryder cemented himself as a big-game player in my book last night. Great game from the Newfoundlander.
While the Leafs turned out to not make it to the playoffs either, its settling to know we kept the arch rival habs out aswell.
Ryder had another good year and I think we'll see 40 out of him next year, depending on what the Hab team looks like. I'm willing to bet however, his younger brother out in Calgary, Daniel, will be just as good if not better than Michael.. thats if he gets his act together attitudewise.
I still think Souray is overrated, but yes okay, I was wrong. He wasn't a flash in the pan.
Had a boy Johnny,it takes a man to admit he was wrong!
But you are right about Souray being overated,a big minus -20+ and here's the whopping stat only 16 even strength points!:eek: The second coming of Bryan McCabe is here!
Cheers
Okay a defencman has a -28 plus/minus rating but because he has scored a few power play goals that makes him great?
Call me stupid but I wouldn't hand over 5 mill for this guy with a propensity to score when you have the man advantage when the time you don't is much longer and all the more important. And to top it off he is a career plus/minus rating of -29!
In all due respect Rusty, we only had 6 players on the + side. The problem was not as much Souray as it exposed the team's deep problems at 5 on 5 all year long. Although he's no Norris trophy caliber defensively, he's not getting enough credit for his defensive play, his passing abilities and the way he carries the puck. I'm with you though that some team will offer him a McCabe-type contract in hope to draw a big name to draw some fans...
I wouldn't give him more than $5 million per season on a 3 year deal. Here's what Sheldon did this season:
First in the league in goals amongst defensemen, 6 more than Dan Boyle, his closest competitor!
3rd in the entire NHL in points amongst defensemen, 5 points from Neidermayer who leads the league!
Broke a league record with 19 PP goals in a season for a defenseman!
His 6 game winning goals are tops amongst defensemen in the league!
Second in the NHL amongst defensemen in shots behind Dion Phaneuf!
Second in the league in shooting % amongst defensemen!
Second in the NHL in takeaway amongst defensemen, behind Andrei Markov!
Second on the team in goals!
Second on the team in points!
First on the team in PP goals!
First on the team in game winning goals!
First on the team in shots!
Second on the team in ice time, just behind Markov!
First on the team in blocked shots!
Third on the team in takeaways!
His critics are saying that he's not good defensively, that he coughs up the puck too much? Both Andrei Markov and Mike Komisarek have more giveaways than Souray! Yet, they don't have near as much impact offensively...
Souray is one of the leaders on our team, some will argue that he's the true leader! He's the one who went after Colby Armstrong after his hit on Koivu... He will drop the gloves in spite of a series of wrists surgeries, jeopardizing his career by fighting for his team and teammates. Some fans in Montreal say that he should be the one wearing the "C".
henry rollins
6-11-07, 7:07 PM
+/- is garbage but the fact remains he is garbage too Stephen Hawking has more mobility than Souray.
+/- is garbage but the fact remains he is garbage too Stephen Hawking has more mobility than Souray.
Can Stephen Hawking put up the numbers posted above? :sign:
Okay I have been looking all over the place and I can't find his name anywhere on any team. And here I was lead to believe he was one of the elite dmen in the game today, even though he is -28 this year alone!
Are they courting 90% of the league and he is mulling over 23 offers? Or are the teams sorta kinda scared to give this guy a contract because of his defensive disabilites even though he is a dman?????
Good on the powerplay but sucks at his primary job in life..........
Oh and BTW I am sure that Hawking could get better +/-'s then that!
Madferret
7-04-07, 11:58 AM
+/- is garbage but the fact remains he is garbage too Stephen Hawking has more mobility than Souray.
And a much cooler voice.
Madferret
7-04-07, 11:58 AM
Okay I have been looking all over the place and I can't find his name anywhere on any team. And here I was lead to believe he was one of the elite dmen in the game today, even though he is -28 this year alone!
Are they courting 90% of the league and he is mulling over 23 offers? Or are the teams sorta kinda scared to give this guy a contract because of his defensive disabilites even though he is a dman?????
Good on the powerplay but sucks at his primary job in life..........
Oh and BTW I am sure that Hawking could get better +/-'s then that!
If McCabe can do it Rusty, Souray can. Same player man.
Actually McCabe's plus minus is a hell of a lot better.
I have a problem with dmen who have double digit minuses.
If Souray gets what some are thinking McCabes deal looks a lot better.
Still not signed yet...................
Almost a week into the "Free Agency Frenzy" and the dman with the most goals on the Pplay in history still has yet to put his name on a contract.......makes you wonder eh?
KB in Kelowna
7-12-07, 8:19 PM
He signed with Edmonton.
charlio lemieux
7-12-07, 8:37 PM
He signed with Edmonton.
:laughing: :laughing: :laughing: :laughing:
Flash - Ah - Saviour of the universe
Flash - Ah - He'll save ev'ry one of us
Seemingly there is no reason for these
Extraordinary intergalactical upsets (ha ha ha)
What's happening Flash?
:laughing: ;)
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