Where is poor attendance REALLY a problem...

[Mel]

With the NHL back from a year hiatus I decided to take a peek at attendance so far. I was a bit surprised at what I saw. Take a look for yourself: http://sports.espn.go.com/nhl/attendance?sort=home_capacity_avg&year=2006

That's home game attendance so far this year, sorted by capacity of the home arena.

The bottom 7?

24 - New York Islanders
25 - New Jersey Devils
26 - Buffalo Sabres
27 - St. Louis Blues
28 - Carolina Hurricanes
29 - Washington Capitals
30 - Chicago Blackhawks

I hear a lot about how hockey doesn't belong in Texas and Arizona... how it doesn't belong in Nashville, Atlanta or Florida.

Why don't I ever hear people complaining that hockey doesn't belong in Chicago or St. Louis? Washington? Buffalo? Long Island?

The lowly Blue Jackets are putting more dumpers in the seats per night than the tradtional market Boston Bruins.

The Islanders are pulling in 13,427 a night... and that includes one home game against the Rangers which normally makes for a sell-out. So that statistic is actually padded, seeing as they've only had four home games so far. Never the less that total is...

500 less per game than the Carolina Hurricanes
900 less per game than the Nashville Predators
2,200 less per game than the Florida Panthers
2,500 less per game than the Phoenix Coyotes
3,000 less per game than the Atlanta Thrashers
3,500 less per game than the Columbus Blue Jackets


If the NHL ever does contract they should start first and foremost on Long Island, NY.

Anyone who tends to knee-jerk against expansion should take a closer look at the numbers, and see where the NHL is really failing.

[leaferfan87]

Funny you mention Atlanta, Florida and Nashville. Look at who would have been on your list had you included a few more teams.

[Madferret]

The game in Carolina on Monday was played to a stadium about 1/4 full.
Nashville's 8-0 and they're 23rd in attendance, what do you think those numbers would be if they were losing?
Ottawa ahead of Toronto? Who knew..

[bluemeanie]

Ottawa ahead of Toronto? Who knew..

It looks like the chart is based on only three games for Ottawa, presumably the first three... two games of which were probably sold out thanks to Leaf fans. =]

[bluemeanie]

It looks like the chart is based on only three games for Ottawa, presumably the first three... two games of which were probably sold out thanks to Leaf fans. =]

Never mind, Toronto was HOME once... duh.

[Max Power]

It looks like the chart is based on only three games for Ottawa, presumably the first three... two games of which were probably sold out thanks to Leaf fans. =]

Believe it or not I think the TO game was the only game that hasn?t been sold out so far

[bluemeanie]

Believe it or not I think the TO game was the only game that hasn?t been sold out so far

What the hell are you talking about? Pictures, Max... pictures. =]

[Mel]

Funny you mention Atlanta, Florida and Nashville. Look at who would have been on your list had you included a few more teams.

That's why I did not include them in my list. The point I was making was about all the supposedly "real" teams that do worse than the cursed southern franchises. It's a myth. Numbers don't lie.

People complain bitterly about expansion, but looky here... Columbus is a bigger draw than:

Edmonton, Boston, Pittsburgh, New Jersey, St. Louis, Chicago and about 10 other teams. I just find it interesting.

The Islanders and Devils both play in the largest U.S. TV market, and as such are 2 of a handful of teams that will never be allocated revenue sharing handouts even if they are eligible.

The fact that Nashville is low on the list is not surprising. The fact that they outdraw the St. Louis, Washington, Chicago and the Islanders is astounding.

[Max Power]

I don't think Washington has ever been on anybodies 'good' list.
Chicago is a little surprising but fans have lost interest shortly after the ownership did.

http://www.blazinbeauties.com/images3/rachel_stevens/rachel_stevens_4.jpg

[KB in Kelowna]

T
The fact that Nashville is low on the list is not surprising. The fact that they outdraw the St. Louis, Washington, Chicago and the Islanders is astounding.

Given the strong hockey history of some of the hilited franchises, I would say it is disturbing.

[Yoata]

Given the strong hockey history of some of the hilited franchises, I would say it is disturbing.

Washington and Carolina don't suprise me, Chicago, NYI, and Boston I think are likely due in part to backlashes against Ownership/management who've either chiselled the fans in recent years (Boston and Chicago), or so badly mismanaged the team that fans have given up (Milbury). Buffalo is a tough market, wedged in between a lot of popular and storied franchises. Imagine how bad NJ would have done without 3 cup wins in recent years. :eek:

[slapshot™]

People complain bitterly about expansion, but looky here... Columbus is a bigger draw than:

Edmonton, Boston, Pittsburgh, New Jersey, St. Louis, Chicago and about 10 other teams. I just find it interesting.

Oilers = Rexall Place = 16,839 (capacity)
Blue Jackets = Nationwide Arena = 18,500 (capacity)

Bigger arena, yes. Bigger draw - no.

[Mel]

What I was going by was average fans per game so far this season

CBJ - 16,939
EDM - 16,839
BOS - 16,551



Percent capacity-wise yes Edmonton does better. and Boston does just a shade better. But arena capacity really only factors in when you're talking about sell-outs.

(same for Nashville and others... when I said "outdraw" I was referring to fans per game)

[Madferret]

Rexall is the old Edmonton Coliseum correct?

[slapshot™]

Rexall is the old Edmonton Coliseum correct?

Correct. Rexall...as in Rexall Drugs...hence the monikor, the Drug Den.

http://www.pharmassist.ca/images/rexall_brand_logo.gif

The Katz Group (http://www.katzgroup.ca/) is one of North America's leading drug store operators with system sales exceeding $6.5 billion. The company operates over 1,800 drug stores in Canada and the United States.

In addition to its retail operations, the Katz Group owns and operates Canada's only national mail order pharmacy business, Meditrust Healthcare Inc., one of Canada's largest institutional pharmacy operations servicing over 15,000 lodge and nursing home beds.

The Katz Group is proud to maintain close contacts with McKesson Corporation, one of the largest suppliers to North America's retail pharmacy industry.

Katz Group Inc. is a Canadian-owned privately held company started by Daryl Katz in 1990. Since the company?s inception, the story of Katz Group has become one of Canada?s and Edmonton?s most fascinating business stories. In just over 10 years, Katz Group went from purchasing franchise rights to Medicine Shoppe Pharmacy in Canada to having more than 1,800 pharmacies within its network, 1,500 of which are in Canada. Today, Katz Group is one of Canada?s largest privately owned companies.


Edmonton Coliseum -> Northlands Coliseum -> Skyreach Centre -> Rexall Place.

IIRC the Coliseum was built in 1972 for the WHA Edmonton Oilers. Prior to that they played in the Edmonton Gardens (where the Edmonton Flyers used to play). The design was based on the Pacific Coliseum in Vancouver.

Small by today's NHL standards. A new building will have to be built in the next 5 years. Extensive renovations took place about 4 or 5 years ago. It has the best ice in the League.

[Madferret]

Thanks K..

:thumb:

[The Insider]

I'm not going to sugarcoat anything, outside the die-hard markets, Hockey is a bandwagon sport. If the team is losing, no one shows up, if the team is mediocre they draw below average attendance, if the team is winning, they draw decent attendance and if the team is competing for a championship, expect a sell out. Now factoring out the expansion issue, here are what I call die hard markets(in no particular order:thumb: ):

Toronto
Montreal
Detroit
Philly
Edmonton
Ottawa
Columbus
Minnesota
New York Rangers
Vancouver
Calgary
Los Angeles

Now I might be a bit bias, but when it comes to die hard, the entire list must include Canadian team since no matter what, people will still show up to see it. The thing I found when I was compiling the list was that i could only think of 6 American teams who could be considered die hard and 2 of them are expansion teams. Some teams you may be surprised I didn't include would be:
Colorado & Tampa, Colorado has always been able to ice a competitive team since they became the Avs in the mid nineties, but now that the team may take a step down when it comes to competing, I want to see how loyal the fans are, same with Tampa they draw well now and compete, but if that goes do the fans as well?

Everyone else though if they're winning they show up, if not, they probably can't even tell you the team's name.

[PDO]

What I was going by was average fans per game so far this season

CBJ - 16,939
EDM - 16,839
BOS - 16,551



Percent capacity-wise yes Edmonton does better. and Boston does just a shade better. But arena capacity really only factors in when you're talking about sell-outs.

(same for Nashville and others... when I said "outdraw" I was referring to fans per game)

Edmonton = 100% capacity.
Columbus = 91.5% capcity.

Edmonton ticket prices: http://www.edmontonoilers.com/tickets/singles.php
Columbus ticket prices: http://www.ticketmaster.com/event/05003B0194E8C5FC?artistid=805927&majorcatid=10004&minorcatid=9

So.. in Columbus you can buy a ticket in the lower bowl for $52.00
That same ticket in Edmonton will cost you 98.75

Almost twice as much :)

[go_leafs_go02]

What's going on in St. Louis? I look at the attendance stats every day in the box scores of the sports section..and I cant rememeber St. Louis not selling out games ever before this year.

2000-01: St. Louis 4th overall with 19, 519 average attendance at 102.6%
2001-02: St. Louis 5th overall with 18, 968 average attendance at 99.7%
2002-03: St. Louis 5th overall with 18, 570 average attendance at 97.6%
2003-04: St. Louis 6th overall with 18, 560 average attendance at 97.6%
2005-06: St. Louis 25th overall with 13, 915 average attendance at 73.2%

man that really surprised me..could be with the Cardinals run..but still..almost 5,000 drop in attendance overall?

Thats sad.

stats taken from ESPN's NHL attendance page.

[KB in Kelowna]

What's going on in St. Louis? I look at the attendance stats every day in the box scores of the sports section..and I cant rememeber St. Louis not selling out games ever before this year.

2000-01: St. Louis 4th overall with 19, 519 average attendance at 102.6%
2001-02: St. Louis 5th overall with 18, 968 average attendance at 99.7%
2002-03: St. Louis 5th overall with 18, 570 average attendance at 97.6%
2003-04: St. Louis 6th overall with 18, 560 average attendance at 97.6%
2005-06: St. Louis 25th overall with 13, 915 average attendance at 73.2%

man that really surprised me..could be with the Cardinals run..but still..almost 5,000 drop in attendance overall?

Thats sad.

stats taken from ESPN's NHL attendance page.

doesn't surprise me, saddens me as St.Louis is a great sports market and have been a strong hockey market, but the fans looked at this team voted tostay away.

[Canadian26]

St.louis is also having on of their worst starts ever... which could account for the low attendance early on.. If they start winning some games I, sure the attendence will increase a bit. They've also lost some key players like Progner this offseason...

So.. in Columbus you can buy a ticket in the lower bowl for $52.00
That same ticket in Edmonton will cost you 98.75

Its prolly only around a 30 dollar differance in prices... unless both prices are listed in Canadian dollars.